Glad I got some conversation started. Will tackle some of the comments, but first wanted to say something I probably should have started my other post with.
I am not a fan of big government. It is inefficient and they get too much into every one's business. Personally I would like to see us get back to more State rights where they can better handle our problems instead of having our large government decide on a broad based level what is best for everyone. A great example is education. There is not one solution for an entire, extremely diverse country. Everyone should be challenged and given an opportunity to perform at their highest ability. Politicians rarely know much besides politics and how to get elected to public office. They have great ideas they then tax us to fund and when they do not turn out so great the program stays because it is too difficult to get rid of and just raise taxes to start some more programs. I am all for helping people, but I think smaller government and more groups (charities, churches, etc) need to be getting in there and helping, esp with things like education. Children can learn to read and write, but without a mentor showing them life can be different and inspiring them to do something then the outcome is more then likely going to be the same.
So, some rebuttals...
I was not referring to a flexible spending account, everyone can participate in that. This is a "health savings account" or something (not 100% sure what they are calling it). It is funded by the bank to make up for the difference in the higher premium and deductibles. Problem? Not everyone qualifies for the $2000, some people just get to pay the extra. Some people call it a Robin Hood plan. Higher earners pay more to cover the cost to the group.
Low income children (or children of low income individuals, not sure the correct wording) already do have medical insurance through the government. Large groups of healthy adults do not want to pay for something they do not think they will need. So, with some probability there are groups of people who will not want to pay for insurance no matter the cost (crazy to me too, but a lot of people do not see the point, "it won't happen to me" mentality). They may or may not get sick, but in order to make insurance work you need the "healthy" people paying in without really using it.
The best idea I have heard (and not from either presidential candidate) is to make preventative medicine more affordable (without insurance) and have very inexpensive insurance for catastrophes. Will not happen, but makes more sense to me then anything else.
I do not believe we are one of the fattest countries due to lack of health insurance. This is far more likely due to convenience issues and laziness. Fast food (or even just eating out in general) and video games do not make for healthy kids or healthy adults.
Bonuses. I completely understand what bonuses are for. All of my sales jobs have involved bonuses for meeting goals. Being involved in banking I now have an actual idea of how it works also. Investment banking is different. (Disclaimer, this is not including executive compensation, that is out of control.) These guys work all the time. No social plans are in ink. It is stated when interviewing and hiring that most of the compensation is paid in an annual bonus. The actual salary is minimal and much less then they could make elsewhere (corporate finance). Why is the annual bonus so much of the total compensation? Because these deals bring in up to 20 million in fees alone for arranging the deal (not including the interest the bank makes off the money that is borrowed by the company). Would you want some guy who is responsible for the deal to decide he is out and just not show up? The bank not only loses that 20 million in fees, but the companies funding would not be available when needed and the company suddenly goes out of business because they cannot pay their bills. These guys only do it day in day out knowing come February it will hopefully be worth it. In Matt's group alone about 25% of the group leaves in March and April to go somewhere else or do something else within the bank. They are also given a heads up a year in advance if they are not going to be promoted. It is almost like contract work.
Why the bailout should not affect which banks should give bonuses? The government made all the banks take the bailout so people would not know which ones were and which ones were not in trouble. Not all banks are losing money. They may not be making record profits like they were last year, but they are still making money.
Other capitalist countries? Capitalism is a fairly new idea and tends to go hand in hand with democracy (also a fairly new idea). The United States was one of the first countries (if not the first) to engage in it. It is one of the things that makes this country the land of promise. You can achieve anything IF you work hard. That is what capitalism is. So no, no examples of other countries.
Canada and a year of paid maternity leave. Well, as Molly already pointed out, it is not 100% pay and I am curious how that not only affects small business owners (someone has to pay that), but the hiring of "females of child bearing" years and their opportunities of even getting hired. Also, do the dads have the same option to also stay home for a year at the same rate of compensation? What about if you adopt?
Glad we have a conversation going it has been educational. Again, my vote for McCain is based not only on his fuller resume, but the fact that he is much more center line and will hopefully not sprawl government out of control. There is also the element of checks and balances. If all three branches go one direction then whatever the far left wants, they will get. On the the same note, Congress is already a democrat majority and their approval rating is at 15%.
2 comments:
The question I would have to ask with bonuses would be: If these people are so vital and important to the bank and the bank will lose millions of dollars in fees if they don't show up and walk away, then shouldn't the bank pay them a higher salary and get rid of the bonus aspect of it all? I guess it is neither here nor there at this point but that seems to make more sense to me then promising them a bonus because they are important to you but then not paying them when the execs screw up. I have never understood that though...why bonuses are pretty much guaranteed. My bonus is based strictly on the company's performance...they do bad, I get no bonus...doesn't matter how much I worked, how much money I made them or how much I saved them this year. That seems to me more what it should be....pay the people what they deserve!
The insurance that you refer to that the low income children get is from the government...so it sort of made my point. I think that they deserve that so I don't want to see it go away. I think that they also deserve better education, as you have already pointed out.
Also, I don't think that we are fat due to no health insurance but along with nationalized healthcare comes all the free and cheap preventative stuff, at least what I have read on it, so it does help. And yes, not stuffing your face or actually walking or biking somewhere would also do wonders for fat asses! I read somewhere that obesity would drop 7% if gas stayed above $4 a gallon because people wouldn't eat out and would walk/bike! Put one in the win column for high gas prices.
I think that state rights are good in theory but when I say capitalism doesn't work on its own, here is what I meant. If we were a true 100% capitalist society then there would have been no bailout. I agree the bailout was 100% necessary...it sucks but the fallout if they had not done it would be WAY worse...so essentially what you created is a society where capitalism is rewarded (execs getting to the top and their million dollar bonuses) but then as soon as they take one risk too many the government HAS to step in...our country would literally have fallen apart had it not...so, right there you have defeated a true capitalist/democratic society. True capitalism means that if you work hard you get to the top and if you don't then you get nowhere...but it also means that when all the financial people (in this case) screw up then the rest of the country suffers and a recession ensues...the Great Depression was actually a better example of capitalism than today but I don't think that either of us wants it to go back to that point. So, I guess the government has to intervene but it is just a fine line as to when and where and whether you agree with what they are intervening on...you agree with the bailout but not healthcare and that is ok, but I think that is where all these discussions get started because people all have different levels of how much and where. It would be a great experiment to have only state rights and then see what states people moved to....too bad we can't do experiments like that but I would really be interested...you know, have one with all kinds of government programs and then one with no government programs, then some in the middle and see which had the better quality of life....interesting...wonder where I would live? I think that I struggle with the fact that I don't really LIKE government intervention but I see the rationale for it.
Oh, and I have not researched this in detail but the NYT has had a couple articles as well as a couple of news channels (NOT FOX)that talk about the fear some people have of all the branches being Democrat and they said it actually backfires. They said that there are enough of both parties (cause it has happened before for both parties at different times) that are middle of the road people that it is never a landslide. They used the Democrats as an example cause that is what it looks like now and they said that there are actually a lot of very conservative Democrats and right now they vote with the Democrats because there are enough Republicans to stop a bill or pass a bill or whatever is needed. This keeps the Democrats happy cause they feel they are all united but once their vote will actually make a difference people tend to stop voting down party lines...so the Conservative Democrats will vote with Republicans and even it back out. They actually said that whenever one party has control that they get a lot of backlash from their own party from what I call the crazies...the either really right or really left (and none of you are that or we wouldn't have had this discussion) because they want everything passed but in actuality it just doesn't happen. Hope that will help out a little bit with that worry.
And, I am sure that Congree has a low approval rating but I think that part of that is that everyone is tired of the BS from BOTH sides with nothing getting done it feels like. Also, not like W's rating is stellar and he is a Republican, so I think that people are just pissed in general right now.
Never heard of the spending account you have cause we don't have that...it is either a state law or something just his bank does. Truthfully, I wouldn't give up my benefits...I have an AWESOME healthcare plan..I pay $2 per pay period and my company subsidizes the rest and they do it for EVERYONE..... we all get the exact same credit, no matter what you make so if you pick a "cover me and my 10 children plan" then you have to pay a lot more but if you are single like me then you pay literally next to nothing. I guess you could argue that people with families don't benefit as much but I could also argue that if they benefited more then it wouldn't be fair to me...only one family member works here, same as me so I think that it is a pretty fair plan. It does sound like that plan is unfair at the bank but just wanted you to know that it is not the case everywhere :-)
I agree with you that this has been really educational and I really do like to see the points people make and the facts that they know....seems like a political discussion is one of the best ways to get to know your friends and how they really think...too bad too many people get angry. Thanks for keeping it civil :-)
oh and please don't use rebuttals...makes it so "debate-like"...haha, just kidding!!
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